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russbrett 06-27-2013 07:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Renae De Liz (Post 1799676)
Hey Russ! :D Okay before I give a rundown, I need to know

A. What is "Behind the Scenes" and "Advanced View"?

Behind the Scenes: Basically I'm going to create a PDF of all the stages of development of the book (script, rough pencils, final pencils, inks, colors and character bios - like what I've been posting here).

Advanced View: I will e-mail each page as I receive them from the artist. For those who don't want to wait.

Quote:

B. How much does each print issue cost you (INCLUDING shipping/packaging/printing)
For printing and shipping only (without factoring in the cost to pay my artist) I've got $6 per book ($2.67 for printing, 25 cents shipping from printer, $3 shipping to buyer).

Quote:

C. How big is the print and what does it cost you to make?
I'm assuming a 200 issue print run, but since I'm using a Print-on-Demand service...

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D. What did you decide to go for in terms of funding goal (also remind me what your creative costs are to complete the issue/or any other costs you need reimbursed)?
I'm going to pay as much upfront as I can to keep the funding goal low. Right now I have it around $4000.

russbrett 06-27-2013 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aaron Walther (Post 1799677)
Even without knowing what Behind the Scenes or Advance View is, I'd say that your rewards way overpriced.

My name being printed in your book is not worth 5 bucks. Likewise, I wouldn't pay 10 bucks for a 24 page book (and I don't even get a thank you for that one!)

Are you going to charge 10 bucks for the book at a con? You can get away with asking for 10 bucks for the book for the kickstarter, but you gotta throw in some other trinkets to make it look like I'm getting more than I would if I just bought the book from you at a convention. This is what prints, stickers, buttons, etc. are all for. Prints cost next to nothing.

Everybody above the $5 pledge should have a thank you in the book. The thank you is valueless. If you're going to put them in the book, then you should thank everyone, and it should be a freebee with whatever pledge I choose.

Also, you're signature is not worth 5 bucks either.

Quote:

Originally Posted by L Jamal (Post 1799682)
I agree with Aaron.
Give me a bigger book worthy of the $10 I'm giving you.
I'm working a KS for a 150 page art book and it's a $25 book. That's 6 times as many page for 2.5 times the cost. I hope my signature, limited edition numbering, and a sketch is worth $10 buck... and I'm hoping to raise $1500 via selling art and books.

I'm going to have to disagree with you guys. I've looked at a lot of comic book KS campaigns, and $10 for a plain print copy is pretty nominal.

And while I know I couldn't charge $10 at a con, KS isn't a con. At the very least there are shipping fees to deal with (and I'm going to have a KS exclusive cover that will never be reprinted outside of the initial print run from the KS campaign. So... there's at least some measure of exclusivity).

And $5 may not be worth it to you to have your name in the Thank You section, but other people may think it is (and I don't extend it to all Tiers because people are still getting a product. Even the $10 print copy gets you a product at a relatively reasonable price). It's a Tier for people who want to contribute to the creation; beyond just treating KS like an online store.

Also keep in mind, I have to pay an artist. If I could draw and do the whole thing by myself my costs would be a crap-ton lower, and I could charge less for everything. But alas...

I do appreciate the feedback though, guys. It's certainly something to keep in mind. Thank you.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Renae De Liz (Post 1799683)
Here's my suggestion for your rewards (pending answers to my last questions, which could change things).

Overall there's too many tiers and too many duplicate amount tiers. Keep it as sweet and simple as possible, and try not to put any rewards for the same amount.

I was trying to create "All Digital" Tiers for people who don't want a print copy of the book (which is good for me since they essentially cost nothing to make).

Quote:

Hope that helps a little :) What did you decide to do with your video?
Haven't tackled the video yet. I have a friend who is a decent short film maker who is going to help me later in the summer. Most likely it will be a little bit of me talking about the book, a little bit of the artist talking about what he liked about the concept to work on it, and of course artwork from th book itself.

Thanks for the advice. As always, very helpful.

MBirkhofer 06-27-2013 10:40 AM

numbers sound high to me as well.

Crowd funding works alot like a free to play gaming model.

higher tiers essentially pay for the lowest. Everyone one person that invests $200 is paying the entry fee of 5 people. In games, the model ensures an active playerbase. in comics obviously that factor is changed a great deal. however, word of mouth. everyone likes to talk about things they like with friends. so a popular book, will get even more popular due to social aspects just as much, if not more then actual quality of the book.

Taking a hit in profit, or no profit at all in your lowest tiers, may spur interest in the higher tiers.
Which is another question here as well. are you trying to make a profit on this?
Are you setting your goal as making a profit? or is your goal simply breaking even, or perhaps simply a "cut your losses", while overfunding is where your profit will come in?

I personally think trying to make a profit on publication of 23page comics themselves is a lost cause.

amon 06-27-2013 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by russbrett
I've looked at a lot of comic book KS campaigns, and $10 for a plain print copy is pretty nominal.

And that's why the online panhandling model isn't going to work.

Quote:

Originally Posted by russbrett
KS isn't a con.

I disagree.

russbrett 06-27-2013 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MBirkhofer (Post 1799701)
numbers sound high to me as well.

Crowd funding works alot like a free to play gaming model.

higher tiers essentially pay for the lowest. Everyone one person that invests $200 is paying the entry fee of 5 people. In games, the model ensures an active playerbase. in comics obviously that factor is changed a great deal. however, word of mouth. everyone likes to talk about things they like with friends. so a popular book, will get even more popular due to social aspects just as much, if not more then actual quality of the book.

Taking a hit in profit, or no profit at all in your lowest tiers, may spur interest in the higher tiers.
Which is another question here as well. are you trying to make a profit on this?
Are you setting your goal as making a profit? or is your goal simply breaking even, or perhaps simply a "cut your losses", while overfunding is where your profit will come in?

I personally think trying to make a profit on publication of 23page comics themselves is a lost cause.

I'm certainly not trying to make a profit. And while it would be nice to break even, that's not my goal either. Basically, I'm putting as much money down as I can afford (I've been selling off my comic book collection) and then using the goal as the amount needed to finish the project.

The thing with goals and tiers, though, is that one has to assume the possibility of the goal being met by an abundance of the lowest tier.

So even at $10 for a floppy, my costs for printing and shipping are ~$6. So only $4 is left to pay my artist. Even if I'm only paying my artist $2000 (which I'm not) then my Goal Amount needs to be $5,000 (500 backers at the $10 level). And that's a little high for my liking (perhaps I'm jut overly paranoid).

So to lower the price for that Tier would mean raising the Goal amount even more. And doing so (at least in my mind) decreases the chances of reaching my funding Goal (particularly when you consider most KS campaigns that are similar to mine only average around 200 backers).

And not to belabor the point, but backers at that Tier level also get the PDF copy, so it's not like they're just paying $10 for a standard size floppy, only.

I'm not trying to sound argumentative or defensive; these are just the realities of the KS campaign as I see them.

L Jamal 06-27-2013 07:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Renae De Liz (Post 1799684)
That's awesome, Jamal!! :D When is this happening? Can't wait for it!

In July

Renae De Liz 06-27-2013 08:06 PM

Russ, $6 cost per $10 comic only leaves you with $4 (per issue) to go towards creative costs, Kickstarter/Amazon fees, taxes, dropped pledges, mistakes, and whatever else, so your pricing (in terms of being financially feasible) is a little low, but I think you'll manage :)

Hypothetical situation in which you sell nothing but the $10 tier (which won't happen, you'll sell other stuff, I just use this situation to get a quick look at how the numbers fare)

To raise $4K you'd need to sell 400 copies

400 x $6 (cost per issue) = $2400 fulfillment cost, leaving you with $1600

Amazon/Kickstarter fees will be around $400, leaving you with $1200.

That $1200 will be slightly less after you factor in dropped pledges, any refunds (rare), re-shipments (for those packages that get lost) and taxes.

So guessing around $1000 would be left to go towards creative costs IF you sold nothing but the $10 tier. However because you'll sell other tiers that yield a higher profit margin over reward cost, I think you'll balance out somewhere around 1.5K for creative costs.

My judgement based on the artwork so far, if you can make a GREAT video I can see you making around 8K (maybe more) for your Kickstarter project :)

Renae De Liz 06-27-2013 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by L Jamal (Post 1799784)
In July

That's just around the corner! :) I hope you'll post about it so I can help spread the word!

russbrett 06-27-2013 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Renae De Liz (Post 1799785)
Russ, $6 cost per $10 comic only leaves you with $4 (per issue) to go towards creative costs, Kickstarter/Amazon fees, taxes, dropped pledges, mistakes, and whatever else, so your pricing (in terms of being financially feasible) is a little low, but I think you'll manage :)

Hypothetical situation in which you sell nothing but the $10 tier (which won't happen, you'll sell other stuff, I just use this situation to get a quick look at how the numbers fare)

To raise $4K you'd need to sell 400 copies

400 x $6 (cost per issue) = $2400 fulfillment cost, leaving you with $1600

Amazon/Kickstarter fees will be around $400, leaving you with $1200.

That $1200 will be slightly less after you factor in dropped pledges, any refunds (rare), re-shipments (for those packages that get lost) and taxes.

So guessing around $1000 would be left to go towards creative costs IF you sold nothing but the $10 tier. However because you'll sell other tiers that yield a higher profit margin over reward cost, I think you'll balance out somewhere around 1.5K for creative costs.

As always, thank you for the time and effort, Renae. It's very much appreciated.

Quote:

My judgement based on the artwork so far, if you can make a GREAT video I can see you making around 8K (maybe more) for your Kickstarter project :)
That would be incredible. I can only hope.

Renae De Liz 06-27-2013 08:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by russbrett (Post 1799790)
As always, thank you for the time and effort, Renae. It's very much appreciated.



That would be incredible. I can only hope.

No problem! :) I think doubling your goal is likely, just all depends on that video quality. If you ever wish to discuss that I could give input there as well.

studio_hades 07-01-2013 11:57 PM

Videos are overrated. I havent even watched the video on anything i have backed. They can certainly hurt your campaign, but the best video in the world is only as good as the product and the reward design. If those suck, you will still likely fail. A good twitter campaign is much more important than a video.


Evan
Studio-Hades

Ray Dillon 07-02-2013 12:57 AM

No. Videos are absolutely vital to the success of a Kickstarter. You might not have watched any but basically everyone else backing Kickstarters watch the videos. Most put their whole decision on the video and don't read all the text on there.

studio_hades 07-02-2013 11:06 AM

Your page design should be such that any potential backer can get all the information about the project and rewards in less than 30 seconds... which means entirely visually and a pitch that can be boiled down into a sentence. Videos might be useful for product and tech demonstrations or film trailers but for comics and art projects they are a waste of time. And as i said a bad video can certainly hurt you. And a lot of kickstarter videos are painful to watch. A kickstarter with a bad concept, shitty tier structure and muddled layout is still going to fail no matter how good the video is.

Keep it simple stupid applies.

L Jamal 07-02-2013 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Renae De Liz (Post 1799786)
That's just around the corner! :) I hope you'll post about it so I can help spread the word!

Finishing up the video this week and will be launching it next week on Monday or Tuesday.

Ray Dillon 07-02-2013 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by studio_hades (Post 1800199)
Your page design should be such that any potential backer can get all the information about the project and rewards in less than 30 seconds... which means entirely visually and a pitch that can be boiled down into a sentence. Videos might be useful for product and tech demonstrations or film trailers but for comics and art projects they are a waste of time. And as i said a bad video can certainly hurt you. And a lot of kickstarter videos are painful to watch. A kickstarter with a bad concept, shitty tier structure and muddled layout is still going to fail no matter how good the video is.

Keep it simple stupid applies.

I agree that page design, solid reward structure (and pricing), and easy to understand information is also vital, but if you don't have a video you're shooting yourself in the foot. Bad videos are bad. Bad page layout is bad. But no video is also bad. Videos for comics and art projects are not a waste of time, they're a huge help if handled the right way.

Can I see how you set yours up?


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