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Old 11-21-2015, 06:09 AM   #1
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TPG Week 256: Same Problems, Different Script


Welcome back, one and all, to another installment of The Proving Grounds! This week, we have a new Brave One in Jay VanVeen. We also have Liam Hayes in red, Ryan Kroboth with the great pencil, and I'm the guy wondering about my lot in life in red. Together, we're all going to see what happens to

Fin and Bones

Page One

Five Panels

(biggest panel of the page) (Missing capitalization goes a long way in making your script look amateurish.) We look straight on at Fin and Bones as they are sitting shoulder to shoulder at The Bar. They are hunched over drinks and looking weary. A beer sits in front of Bones and a whiskey sits in front of Fin. Cigarettes dangle loosely from both of their lips. (I don't know where this is? Modern bar? Old timey bar? Space bar? Chocolate bar?) (I don't know where this is. Most places in the United States have banned smoking in public places. Private, members-only places are and exception. Is this like that, if we're in the US?)

No dialogue? The silence makes this dull. They are just sitting there. Even a bit of trash dialogue would spice this up.

Click here to read more.
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Old 11-21-2015, 08:44 AM   #2
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5. Bones looks confused and concerned. He is in a state of extreme emotion. (He’s confused, mixed with concern, but he’s also scared, but yet he’s determined not to feel trapped in the hole, and at the same time, he’s happy to be alive…and you want all of that to be shown in his eyes. Rin, why did I go through all of that just now? And what can be done to fix this panel description? What advice would you give?)
I imagine you went through all of that because, over one-and-a-bit pages, we see Bones’ mood go from banter to enjoying his work (whistling, no less), to startled, to shocked, to (in the same panel) being stupefied / scared / flummoxed, then confused / concerned / in extreme emotion. It’s quite the journey.

I’d need more info before I could fix this. How far away is the forest from the city? (This would affect how surprised he would be to see a girl so far away from anyone.) Why is Bones there, doing what he’s doing? (If they’re digging holes to drop dead bodies in, he wouldn’t be pleased to see a witness. If they’re digging a trap to capture an animal, that’d affect how he’d warn the girl. If they’re doing public works, why aren’t they dressed accordingly?) How apparent is it at first glance that the girl's a ghost? How severe is her wound? Mr Hayes is right – we need to know if she’s bleeding out at a litre a minute, or whether one of her piercings has started to trickle. How old is this girl? Bones doesn’t ask where her parents are, at midnight, so far away from anyone. Seeing a pre-adolescent will elicit a different reaction to seeing a young woman, or a senior citizen. And, based on the sexualised conversation on page 3, if the girl is a young woman, how will Bones’ attitude towards the ladies affect his initial reaction towards her? (Bear in mind that this is comics. If the girl is a young woman, your artist is more than likely to whack a pair of double D’s on her.) What exactly does 8 forward slashes sound like? (Incidentally, if you press SHIFT 5x in MS Word, I know what that sounds like.) And, above all, what’s Bones’ character? I’m not getting much sense of it.

My advice would be that there are (at least) three ways for a reader to infer information - facial expression, body language, dialogue. In panel 5, you could give Bones a confused expression, make him physically reach out (to show his concern) / have him anxiously clutching his head (to show extreme emotion, as if literally holding himself together), and / or have him say something that will convey any of the three emotions you’re asking for.
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Old 11-21-2015, 10:47 AM   #3
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Nice post, Rin.

Thanks for doing the edits, Steven and Liam!
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Old 11-21-2015, 10:57 AM   #4
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There are quotations in dialogue for comics when...

A narrator is telling the story to another character.

-Sky
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Old 11-21-2015, 12:55 PM   #5
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I haven't read the script past my drawing panel yet, but I figured I'd post the questions I have now.

1.) Why are you withholding information in the script from the rest of the team?

2.) Are they digging something up or burying something? If burying I need to know to include it! Maybe they are digging for exercise.

3.) How big is the hole? How deep? Knee deep? Waist deep?

4.) If it's night (or twilight) how can we see their expressions with little to no light? I mean, no other light source is mentioned. Oil lamp? Headlights from a truck? They would need to be included in the description.

5.) Are we in a clearing or a dense area? I'm guessing a clearing since digging tree roots is a major pain.

6.) How far back is the camera? I read it as a far shot (since angled from above), but expressions suggest it's closer.

Yes, I read a script in it's entirely before putting my pencil to the paper. If need be I would make notes of things I need to include. Perhaps I'm spoiled working with a writer who is very careful to include everything as early as possible. But I know I never have to worry about his side of the creative process because of that care put into the little things. It saves me a ton of time having to scrutinize the script, and even better, keeps art edits to a minimum. The whole process moves quicker and more efficiently. Time is worth just as much as money in some cases.

Now, to start on my drawing!
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Old 11-21-2015, 07:37 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by Steven Forbes View Post
We also have Liam Hayes in red, Ryan Kroboth with the great pencil, and I'm the guy wondering about my lot in life in red.

I hope Mr Forbes takes this as a compliment, but also makes me scared at the same time, but is Liam using the shade of red also known as blue?
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Old 11-21-2015, 10:28 PM   #7
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I hope Mr Forbes takes this as a compliment, but also makes me scared at the same time, but is Liam using the shade of red also known as blue?
The shade of red formily known as blue.
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Old 11-21-2015, 10:59 PM   #8
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I hope Mr Forbes takes this as a compliment, but also makes me scared at the same time, but is Liam using the shade of red also known as blue?
Here's the hilarious part: I had to go back and re-type some of it because I put Ryan as being in blue! But I went back too far, and wasn't looking as close as I should have when I "corrected" myself.

I'll let it stand.

Thanks, Luke!
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Old 11-22-2015, 11:34 PM   #9
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Shoot in angled above them into the hole they are digging (although we don’t see what they are doing). (How? Surely we would from this angle?) Fin climbs out of the hole in the forefront. We see Bones behind him, down in the hole still. He has a shit-eating grin on his face. (Ryan? Oh, Mister Ryan! Miiiisterrrr Rrrryaaaaannnnnn! Methinks you be up, sirrah. No, no reading ahead. Please work from everything you know up to this panel. Now, if you can’t, please ask the questions that the panel description should have already answered.)
I still haven't read ahead, so I don't know what's going in or coming out of this hole. After this post my questions shall be answered!

Here is the panel I came up with.



Since I don't know for sure if they are burying something, I'm assuming they are instead digging something up because nothing was mentioned. I don't know if this item is a casket, a car, or a cigar case, so I went with a nice, round hole. Everyone digs circular holes, right? The light source is an off-panel truck (parked a bit to the left of the panel) because I'm betting these dudes aren't really in shape to be doing a ton of walking. Those cigarettes will kill ya. And I made the hole a little over knee depth just so that guy can climb out funny.

That's all I have for now, so I'm gonna go finish this week's column to see what happened!
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Old 11-23-2015, 02:32 AM   #10
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Fin is on the phone. Bones tilts his head back and exhales a plume of smoke, like a train getting ready to leave the station. (This is prose. Keep it comic script.) You can show a little of the atmosphere’s character in the background or you can keep it tight on the boys. Up to you. (This is a moving panel. Greg Thayer! Please make this a static panel.)
Gah! Me?!

Fin is on the phone. Bones, head tilted back, has exhaled a plume of smoke.

Better?
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Old 11-23-2015, 04:00 AM   #11
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Much better.

How did it feel?
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Old 11-23-2015, 04:02 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by DarkHalf05 View Post
I still haven't read ahead, so I don't know what's going in or coming out of this hole. After this post my questions shall be answered!

Here is the panel I came up with.



Since I don't know for sure if they are burying something, I'm assuming they are instead digging something up because nothing was mentioned. I don't know if this item is a casket, a car, or a cigar case, so I went with a nice, round hole. Everyone digs circular holes, right? The light source is an off-panel truck (parked a bit to the left of the panel) because I'm betting these dudes aren't really in shape to be doing a ton of walking. Those cigarettes will kill ya. And I made the hole a little over knee depth just so that guy can climb out funny.

That's all I have for now, so I'm gonna go finish this week's column to see what happened!
Nice job as always, Ryan.

Is this how you saw it, Jay? If not, then you have some 'splainin' to do... (Well, you have some 'splainin' to do, anyway.)
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Old 11-23-2015, 11:53 PM   #13
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Tight on Bones. (Maybe even a close up partial shot of his face. Nose to forehead. Something like that) He stands stupefied. His eyes wide. He’s scared and totally flummoxed (Scared: afraid. Flummoxed: bewildered. Ryan, can this be drawn? No need to draw it if you don’t want, unless you want to…ahem…illustrate…why this would be a problem.
I started to do some doodles for this panel description, and then I realized it was impossible. Every emotion called for has a completely different way to depict it. Without the mouth, it would likely be impossible to translate what you are going for. So, instead, I'm going to post a reference for you from a book by Jack Hamm called "Cartooning the Head and Figure". I highly recommend you pick up this book even if you aren't an artist. This one gets pulled all the time.



You can see the difference between flummoxed (I learned a new word today!), which is kinda shock and astonishment, and scared. While the eyes could be drawn fairly similar, that mouth is integral to understanding the emotion. But, yet, they are two different emotions. You also throw stupefy in there, which also means shock and astonishment, so you are calling for the same emotion twice.

Anyway, I hope this helps you out some. I still want to know what was going in or out of that hole they were digging. We never found out. Kinda bummed.
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Old 11-24-2015, 12:04 AM   #14
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Great reference Darkhalf05!
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Old 11-24-2015, 09:43 AM   #15
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Great reference Darkhalf05!
That's one of my favorite reference books. I keep that one right next to my desk!
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