Kickstarter 2012 Stats

[Renae De Liz]

Originally Posted by BClayMoore

The things you stumble over on a slow Saturday night.

Interesting thread, with some strangely bitter posts that are essentially chastising people for paying for something they want to own.

One thing I'd like to address...the idea that funding print versions of online material is some kind of scam is absurd.

Give you a good example:

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/...editi?ref=live

This was an awesome online strip that Ryan had paid out of pocket to produce a tiny print run of, but he couldn't find anyone willing to publish the book without essentially robbing him blind. He wanted a physical book to sell, but couldn't fund it on his own. So he reworked the hell out of the strip, spent tons of unpaid time writing new material, and used his "connections" to get help with pin-ups and backup stories.

And he broke the bank, essentially demonstrating that the market knows more than most publishers do.

Here's the Kickstarter we ran for BAD KARMA:

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/badkarma/bad-karma

We raised that money on faith alone, really, since we had precious little material finished when we launched the campaign. I'm a full-time professional comic book writer, Jeremy is a full-time professional comic book artist and writer, Alex is a full-time (NY Times best-selling) novelist and comic book writer, and Seth is a part-time professional comic book writer. People are willing to support a new project from us partly because they trust us based on work we've done in the past. But we wanted to do a project we had complete ownership and control over, in a (really) nice edition for the shelves of readers. Kickstarter was our best shot at doing so.

-BCM

Hey B. Clay!

Thanks for posting in here! I'm so happy about your Kickstarter's success! Do you have some pointers for people? I'm sure they'd love to hear them!

CMcCormick: I haven't forgotten about you! I have a bunch of stuff to say about the campaign, just haven't had time to write it all down! Will try to tomorrow!

[BClayMoore]

Originally Posted by Renae De Liz

Hey B. Clay!

Thanks for posting in here! I'm so happy about your Kickstarter's success! Do you have some pointers for people? I'm sure they'd love to hear them!

CMcCormick: I haven't forgotten about you! I have a bunch of stuff to say about the campaign, just haven't had time to write it all down! Will try to tomorrow!

Renae -

First of all, you're amazingly patient.

One thing I would recommend, and it's not always possible, since one of the reasons you're raising money for a book is often to pay to have it created, is to have as much of it done as possible beforehand.

We probably could have done that, but in many ways, it was funding the book successfully and setting concrete deadlines that spurred us to make sure the work got done, and to track down collaborators (letters! colorists!) qualified and available to do what we had in mind.

We're in the hole out of the gate, but printed enough copies to cover any losses we've got once sold, and are looking at the book as both a way to introduce our collective identity, and as a gateway to introducing new concepts that we can expand on later.

-BCM

[Renae De Liz]

Originally Posted by CMcCormack

Thanks again for helping me work through this, Renae, getting my head around these numbers has been a pain.

I guess I misunderstood further distribution: This Kickstarter would mark the first time I'm printing this graphic novel. I intend to fulifill using books I'm raising money to print, and the rest will be sold outside kickstarter.

So, I actually looked at the quote incorrectly. The total price to get 500 books printed and taxes and shipping to me is just over 7k (I'm thinking about going for 1000 books though because it's only 600 more for twice the books!)

So here's what I have broken down money wise:

Total print cost: 7k
Number of books it'll take to cover that at the average level of $35: 200
Shipping costs of those 200 books at an average $10: 2k
Which puts my number at 9k, plus 10% for Kickstarter: 700
For a total goal number at $9700?

If so, I feel like that's......going to be really really hard to hit for me.

Paying myself for time would be ideal (in which case this campaign would have to be more like...60k or something to make up for all the work I put into it already hahaha) but for the first one I don't think I can do it

All I have on my website are digital versions of single issues, what I'm presenting through Kickstarter will be unique to Kickstarter

Right now my awards are as follows (rough numbers):

Lowest, as yet unpriced: A digital download of a special features book that includes sketches, excerpts of early versions of the script, process material, and the two stories I did in Heavy Metal Magazine which were the origin for the project

10? - (not sure how to price this or if to use it at all, just came up with it) Dead Meat Kickstarter thank you postcard with small sketch on the back

35 - The Hardcover book, the digital special features book, and a DVD of the short films that go with the comic

50 - Book, Digital special features, DVD, Digital soundtrack album download, small sketch inside the book

100 - Book, Digital special features, DVD, Soundtrack download, large sketch inside of yourself as either zombie or zombie hunter, and a thank you in the book (limited to 50)

200 - Book, Digital special features, DVD, Soundtrack download, Large Sketch, Thank you in book, and a page of original art from the book (limited to 10)

300 - Book, Digital Special features, DVD, Soundtrack download, Large Sketch, Thank you in book, and a character in future issues designed/named after you (limit 2)

500 - Book, Digital Special Features, DVD, Soundtrack download, Large Sketch, Thank you in book, any 2 pages of original art or double page spread (limit 10)

1000 - Book, Digital special features, DVD, Soundtrack, Large Sketch, Extra special thank you in book, and you will be retroactively drawn into the comic in a key scene before it goes to print

I feel like I'm giving away some pretty cool stuff, but I wonder If i'm giving away too much too early?

I've got my main site
(http://eatdeadmeat.com)

Facebook
http://facebook.com/deadmeatcomic

and Twitter
@DeadMeatComic

And I plan on bombarding any websites and blogs etc that I can to get the word out.

Seeing this whole thing started in Heavy Metal Magazine, my shoot for the moon secret plan is to see if I could get Kevin Eastman to write me an intro (after he's seen the book and decided he liked it, of course!)

But a guy can dream...

Thanks so much again

Clay

Okay, so here's a bunch of stuff!

I'm going to present a few scenarios for you to choose from, so I can get a better idea of what you're overall goal is, and to show you more options:

Scenario A (what you're currently trying to do): Doing a hardcover version where you have to purchase 500 books from the printer (is that their minimum amt? can you order less?) means you won't make any money for yourself until you reach a certain amount of books sold. For you, it would be around 300-ish books (or around 10K earned overall). It might be a bit less than that, but just for over-estimate purposes. This means until you reach that threshold, if that campaign earns less than that, you will likely not have any money for yourself personally to take care of anything (in other words, you'd be doing everything in your spare time, hoping no extra costs occur), BUT you'll have 200 books or so that you can further sell to turn a profit on. However, this means further time and effort to sell/ship those books. If you can sell all 500 books (or earn the equivalent funding on other rewards) then you'll have around $3K just for you to keep, which you can use to purchase those extra books if you wish.

I worry about the way this is set up because I KNOW what it's like to run a campaign for NO money, and it's incredibly rough. However, I don't know your financial/time resource situation. if you're able to give the time and are able to cover any extra expenditures that could arise if the campaign goes under 10K, then you may as well go for it

Scenario B: If you went a POD route for a softcover book (lets use Createspace.com for the example) It's $9.95 cost per book, but you only have to purchase however many you sell, meaning you can run a SMALLER campaign, and in the end earn yourself some actual money. For instance:

a 6K campaign would garner you between $2k-$3K IN POCKET for your creative costs. Anything earned more than that would garner you the same ratio in-pocket (10K campaign would be $4k-$5k in pocket).

You would not have extra books on hand unless you order them, but just my opinion; the energy spent on selling extra copies is better spend creating another book.

This scenario is for a slightly less cool book, but money in pocket.

Scenario C: If you went back to a Grayscale book, you'd be in even better shape. The sepia is cool, but the end result is you're paying and charging for a COLOR book, but still have the effect and value of a black and white book (not a comment on the worth of toned books, just how people in general view these types of books). If the book is sepia toned, people will expect to pay B/W pricing, but you're having to charge higher for your rewards because you're paying higher printing costs. The higher pricing for sepia print on this type of book may turn some people away.

If you went Grayscale, your costs would only be around $5-$6 per POD book, and you could offer a cheaper book to the public that would garner more buyers (IOW more of an audience to follow your NEXT campaign)

Anyway, those are just some options for you!

As per your rewards:

1. Overall I suggest wording things differently. If you're including all of a previous reward, it's best to choose wording like "including all of the $__ reward". This allows people to quickly see the one thing they're purchasing a higher tier for, and gets rid of the static, cluttery words from previous rewards.

2. Your $50 and $100 sketches are WAY TOO CHEAP!! Charge at LEAST at the $150 or $200 levels for sketches. If it's just a quick doodle (like really quick) then $65-$100 is okay. Especially if you choose the hardcover campaign, then you'll likely have to spend a lot of time on a lot of sketches, for no money.

3. I will suggest a sketchbook again. It's a cheap and easy way to include another physical item to backers with some cool content (sketches, script, anything)

4. If you only are giving 2 cameos, bump up the price to $350 or more.

And I hope you don't think I'm silly for saying this, but the DVD is a REALLY cool addition to your book, but the general public may not care as much for it unless they can get behind the main BOOK first. So your video really has to sell the story,atmosphere, or whatever it is that makes your book special. If they like the book, THEN they'll be interested in the extras. Overall, I suggest focusing less on selling the extras, and concentrate your selling efforts on the book itself. Trying to sell a person a Book AND movies AND soundtrack as the core reward can be a bit confusing as to what they're supposed to like most, so make it easy by focusing efforts on the book.

Kevin Eastman: That would be awesome! Have you just asked him? I bet he'd do it.

Hope any of that helps Whatever you choose, I think you'll succeed.

[Renae De Liz]

Originally Posted by BClayMoore

Renae -

First of all, you're amazingly patient.

One thing I would recommend, and it's not always possible, since one of the reasons you're raising money for a book is often to pay to have it created, is to have as much of it done as possible beforehand.

We probably could have done that, but in many ways, it was funding the book successfully and setting concrete deadlines that spurred us to make sure the work got done, and to track down collaborators (letters! colorists!) qualified and available to do what we had in mind.

We're in the hole out of the gate, but printed enough copies to cover any losses we've got once sold, and are looking at the book as both a way to introduce our collective identity, and as a gateway to introducing new concepts that we can expand on later.

-BCM

Thanks for this! Great advice!

[darukin]

Originally Posted by Renae De Liz

Hi! Of course I know all about you! Ray has talked about it a bunch! I love your work, btw!



GN's generally will sell better than single issues on KS, but a single issue is fine to start with. However, if you have content that runs over 48 pages, you may as well do a small GN (look at Fairy Quest by Humberto Ramos on KS). Single issues are pretty expensive to print unless you got a deal somewhere, and GN's will generally fit into the most sellable bracket ($25) better than a single issue, and most people prefer GNs over multiple single issues as well.

Raising creative costs for an entire GN usually means a pretty large campaign. If you have Ray's art and a GREAT video and layout, I think you could do it, but of course the higher the funding needed, the more risk that it may fail. A single issue would be an almost for sure thing, but less money overall earned. It depends on how high you want to reach.

Artwork for a KS, you will need SOME art, but you don't need the whole issue. Basically to start you just need iconic images for the video (maybe just select panels), and maybe a couple pages of the most interesting part of the book. Just be sure to make that video REALLY good if you're going for a GN.



If you don't need that funding for #1, then you can use that money raised to put towards #2 if you want. You don't need to offer the second issue as a reward, I think backers would be happier not having to wait for a second issue anyway. Just say you're raising funds to help kick-start the series (which is true), and offer #1 as the core reward (assuming you go for the single issue)




Pre-Kickstarter: For a few weeks before the KS make sure you have as many social sites for your project (Twitter, FB, Tumblr) as well as a main site (could use blogger for that) established, and start gaining attention/followings for them. Do this by following a LOT of people on Twitter and engaging with them, and putting up Facebook ads (if you can afford it) to start drawing attention and followers to the project. Try to start out with a strong piece of art, then a few weeks before the campaign, have a piece of art to put out every few days (images made for the KS campaign is fine) to keep up interest. Let people know you'll be launching a campaign soon, so people are aware of it.

Also contact as many news sites/blogs as possible (doesn't matter if they have a large following or not) and ask if they'd be interested in posting an interview/article about your project. Have a few come out before the Kickstarter, but you want most of them to hit right in the first few days of the campaign (those are the days when you'll see the most activity). You could also try making it known on your sites that if anyone is interested in highlighting your project on their site, you'd love to put links in your book for them (include a special page just for their links).

During the campaign, there's more to do, but most of the work comes with starting everything up.

Basically, the two things I've seen work wonders are A) Facebook ads; and B) magically getting retweeted by someone with millions of followers. Not just them hitting RT, but actually posting about it personally.


I hope all of that made sense!

Thanks Renae that's very helpful, means a lot!
And indeed you are very patient!

All the Best!
Rami

[CMcCormack]

Hey Renae,

Thanks so much for that extensive breakdown!

So, I spent basically all evening yesterday running numbers and doing them out, and I came to the conclusion that because of the way shipping the books really sort of hoses you, if I offered my book as low as $30, the only way I would break even is if my goal was set at $13k or so, and I managed to sell about 400 books, leaving me with only 100 books in inventory. Any other goal amount less than this and I lose money that I really don't have.

SO, what my plan is right now is to re-think my approach. I'm probably going to postpone my campaign for a month or so, but my new tactic, if successful, will cover cost of printing, cost of shipping, and kickstarter fees with a much lower goal - and one that doesn't hurt me the more books I sell!

And if it don't work, then hey, I'll just rethink it again for Kickstarter Campaign part 2: Kick Harder!

Thanks again so much for all your help - can't wait to see Peter Pan!
(and let me know what stretch goal I'd need to raise to get you and Ray to do a pinup for my book )

-Clay

[ktrug]

Renae and others have posted some good advice on here.

Just to throw my 2 cents in from my experience (I didn't meet my goal which was way to high).

Be prepared to do a lot of work recruiting (especially if you are new to creating a comic and have no following.) Be prepared to work just as hard after you launch. Just don't think you can sit back and have strangers throw money at you.

Besides social media, find other ways to spread the word. Go to local comic shops or game shops and introduce yourself to the owners and see if you can leave info there or have them help spread the word.

Find comic blogs that you can go on and talk about your project and the kickstarter experience.

Build everything up towards your opening day. You want big numbers right away cause as the sooner you reach your goal, then the more likely a stranger will jump in on the project. People like to support projects that succeed and that they know will get them a reward in return, so it is critical to get your percentage up high right away. People don't want to support something they don't see being successful.

You will need more than just your friends and family to help with so start making connections before and plan ahead.

Hope this helps any of you looking to start and good luck to you when you do!

Also if you do run a campaign - please make sure to use your updates and stay in touch with your backers. From a backer perspective, I've only supported a couple but one keeps us updated and I would probably support again but the other guy has not and regardless of how I enjoy it, I will not support him again. Don't make people feel like you took their money and then stopped caring. It doesn't take much to update and it is easy to lose people along the way.

Kevin

[domja]

@Renae- Well since you seem to be very knowledgable on the subject of kickstarter I have a couple of questions. Ok so my webcomic http://pt.thecomicseries.com/ is about 60 pages in and I thought I would do a kickstarter for the first GN. The comic is black and white and I figured I would get it colored through the kickstarter, but reading some of your other posts I'm not sure that is a good idea. Now I think it might be better to go with just gray tones to save on printing. I would appreciate your insight on this. Actually that is all I need to know at this time.

[Renae De Liz]

Originally Posted by domja

@Renae- Well since you seem to be very knowledgable on the subject of kickstarter I have a couple of questions. Ok so my webcomic http://pt.thecomicseries.com/ is about 60 pages in and I thought I would do a kickstarter for the first GN. The comic is black and white and I figured I would get it colored through the kickstarter, but reading some of your other posts I'm not sure that is a good idea. Now I think it might be better to go with just gray tones to save on printing. I would appreciate your insight on this. Actually that is all I need to know at this time.

Hi Domja!

I think it's a great idea, actually! You have all the content done (besides coloring) so there's no reason why you shouldn't do this.

Lets assume you'll need $3500 creative costs total ($2500 for coloring, which is about $40 a page, and $1000 for your own expenses), which means about a 7K campaign. Of course if you need less than $40 a page, the funding goal would be less, but I highly suggest earning a bit for yourself to cover your time expenditures for this.

Now let's just assume you'll do a Soft Cover edition from Createspace.com, which would bring total fulfillment cost (per US backer) to around $10 each. So you should charge this in the $20 tier, with digital extras/thank you. You could use Ka-blam, but it's more expensive (by around $2.15 extra per copy, pushing it to the $25 tier).

This is just a starter example for you. Using these calculations, Any amt earned over the funding goal, will yield 50% pure profit, just for you (as your content is done, and after the goal amt is achieved, the coloring is paid for).

Let me know if you have further questions, or if I didn't answer what you were asking about.

[domja]

Thanks Renae. That is very useful info. I was gooing to aim for the end of the year but now I will probably do it alot sooner. Do you know of any colorists looking for work? I doubt I have quite the network that you have.

[Jasen Smith]

I have been working on a novel series for several years now but it has slowly been growing into something that has become a great hobby for me.
I am curious, does Kickstarter have a success with Novels?
I looked on there today but it seems like most are established authors or creating anthology books.

I wonder if it is possible to have a novel funded?
The prizes are artwork from the book or concept art.
What would I need a novel funded for?
For starters, a good editor. It's rough reading your novel over and over and correcting errors or at least another set of eyes.
Secondly, marketing the book. That is not cheap by any means. Going to cons, making appearances, and such.

[Tanja]

Jasen, I picked up a novel recently that got published through Kickstarter funding: "The Girl Who Would Be King". You might find the following links of interest -- the author also posted her thoughts about the experience, what worked or what didn't go as expected. I'd actually thought about posting it here but hadn't gotten around to it yet. I originally found out about her story through a post on io9:
http://io9.com/em-the-girl-who-would...best-453756801

Link to her post about what she learned from her Kickstarter:
http://litreactor.com/columns/what-i...my-kickstarter

Link to the original Kickstarter page:
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/...-would-be-king

- t

[Jasen Smith]

That's awesome! Thanks for the info.

[studio_hades]

Kickstarter is no more begging than pre ordering stuff from Previews. I dont get how some people look at it as begging or "Vanity Publishing". You are essentially ordering a product, like a network orders more TV shows THAT HAVENT BEEN PRODUCED UNTIL THEY ORDER THEM.

Evan
Studio-Hades
www.studio-hades.com

[amon]

The argument certainly could be made that soliciting in Previews is akin to begging; and it often is vanity press, no question. In those regards, the two are very similar indeed. The differences come when, on Kickstarter, you're usually asked to pay a premium price for the product, higher than a feasible price point in Previews. Then there's no organizational support or guarantee you'll ever receive the product from Kickstarter (even if the promotion is funded), whereas Diamond offers some repercussions for perpetrators of vaporware.

Also, making comics involves pencils and paper. You want to do it, do it. There's no need to go begging for thousands of dollars.