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Old 05-17-2015, 11:47 PM   #16
MattTriano
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scribbly View Post
Yes, I am addressing you when I say "your samples", because at some point you must had to show "your" unsolicited samples to somebody in order to get your job as published comics artist. Wherever it was in a convention, showing your coursework to somebody, sending samples by email or regular mail or having a diligent agent doing the moves for you.
My advise to this artist is to work samples for publishers that are below the line of the big 4 publishers and go from there to the top. This guy has real talent and conditions, regardless how old he may be, or where he lives. These Daredevil samples are not his best stuff, compared with what he has shown before in these forums. And I truly believe he would be a good fit for any of these publishers I mentioned. From my perspective, the only thing this guy need is to have the proper contacts.
Maybe you would like to address him to the attention of your artistic agent?
That could be a nice thing to do. Don't you think?
I'll say it a different way: unless you go to a con with a portfolio review or the company accepts unsolicited material in a talent hunt, very few roads exist outside of that system to show samples. When companies commission a sample, that's called a tryout; I have done several tryouts, some I got some I didn't, all necessarily solicited. Unsolicited samples often lead to tryouts if the creator is good enough, but very rarely will an editor open an unsolicited email from someone they don't know. It happens, but it's rare. Keep in mind that my route to working professionally is strange, it's not a path easily followed -- it's not even one I could duplicate for myself, for example, now that DC has moved coasts. This is a complex thing that I don't fully comprehend, I'm not sure who does. It's very difficult.

As for your suggestion, I haven't seen his other work and I don't know him personally; I would not feel comfortable linking him up with anyone. I didn't get my first few years of work through an agent, because agents don't generally work with people they don't know and who haven't been published before; most people also do not have an agent in comics for a number of reasons, I wouldn't presume that anyone wants an art agent without their say. You clearly believe in him and that's great, but age and location do sometimes play a factor in who you meet, and where you go to show work. It seems to be a lot like learning a language, easier when one is young.

Now let's address your tone. You've commented here and elsewhere following my posts, always repeating questions I and other members of the board have sufficiently answered, adding backhanded quips disguised as honest queries or even compliments; you keep mentioning my agent here, for example, with a stinger attached. Each time you respond to me there's a caustic quality to your words. Air out the problem or don't, but please end this behavior for all our sakes. I come here to enjoy a community of people who want to make comics, who like to critique and be critiqued; there is an academic quality to it all that I miss from art school. That's why I'm here. I don't know why you are, Scribbly but if you don't like what I say or how I say it I'm open to addressing those things like real people. Tell me.

Apologies to Xerx for derailing.
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Old 05-18-2015, 01:11 AM   #17
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apologies for continuing the derail..

but I do want to address something to you Mr. Triano.

I to have noticed the back and forth between you and scribbly on occasion. I completely see your point on calling him out on his tone and attitude towards you. but if I may say, you sir have a serious tone and attitude yourself on more than one occasion.
let me explain.
it is certainly obvious that you know what you are doing. that's no question. I follow your art on Deviant art, and have looked you up after seeing you post here on DW. you know, to see who this opinionated guy is. And while your art isn't my favorite on a personal level, you clearly are very very good. an absolute pro.

But if im being honest, your replies sometimes carry the exact tone you are calling scribbly out on. in different ways. its 'caustic' in a way.
and sometimes its downright "douchey" if you recall the time I called you that when your reply to another guy (cant remember who) was really egotistical and out of line. I seriously at that point had written you off, skills or not, as being a big ol dick and not worth interest.

BUT, to your credit, you acknowledged that you were out of line, admitted it was due to other factors and not the fault of the original poster, and apologized.
I thought that was really upstanding. I thought "ok, Triano is just a guy, a human being like all of us. he can have his moments. I don't need to hold a grudge".
but you can see how that type of stuff shapes peoples opinions, right?

I cant deny that your opinions and crits of peoples works are probably correct 99% of the time. you know your stuff.

but your tone man... especially what you just said, about age... its really grinding on me man.
you are always asking peoples age, and I get where you are going with that. it IS a factor.

Heres what you just told me, by posting what you just did here. " I am no good. I never will be, and I need to give up this dream of mine of drawing comics. because im to old."
thanks Matt. can I have my dream back when you are done wiping you ass with it?

I think its that kind of stuff that may rub people the wrong way.

look, im not stupid. I know its a LONG shot. probably never will happen. I know that. I am fully aware of the realities of this industry. im 38. im pissed cause I feel my youth slipping away and it makes me mad that I haven't had the opportunity I want yet. and I know with every passing year, im just getting older. and it may never happen.
but im gonna keep on trying. I don't exactly want to draw xmen or batman. I DO want to put together my own comic, submit it around, see if I can get it picked up...Image comics would be nice.
but that's like winning the comics lottery. 1 in a billion shot. I know that. but I think I may have something to offer. I think I have something to say that may be worthwhile.

and a guy like you, saying essentially, "give it up, its not gonna happen".

you really can crush a guys spirit sir.

how about, "keep trying man. you got some skills, but work on this or that or whatever.. keep going!!! comics are awesome and we all love the dream."?

I want to say again, I know you know what you are doing. what you are saying. its an experienced and educated point of view. but many of your responses (not all) are tinged with a "holier than tho" attitude. maybe you don't mean it that way. maybe you don't perceive it that way.
hell, maybe you DO know it, and don't care.(I doubt you are that heartless)

I just wanted to say these things to you..food for thought.

I have some sequentials I will be posting when I get the okay from the publisher... and I truly hope I get the straight forward "triano crit", cause I need to hear what I need to work on. (reference everything, work on my figures, work on backgrounds, work on storytelling, will all be things you will probably say to me.)
I look forward to it. I invite it and welcome it.

I don't need a pro telling me im to old and to give up this art I pursue cause its never gonna happen. that I don't need.

thanks for your time.

Rob

AGAIN, SORRY FOR ADDITONAL DERAIL
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Old 05-18-2015, 01:24 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scribbly View Post
Yes, I am addressing you when I say "your samples", because at some point you must had to show "your" unsolicited samples to somebody in order to get your job as published comics artist. Wherever it was in a convention, showing your coursework to somebody, sending samples by email or regular mail or having a diligent agent doing the moves for you.
My advise to this artist is to work samples for publishers that are below the line of the big 4 publishers and go from there to the top. This guy has real talent and conditions, regardless how old he may be, or where he lives. These Daredevil samples are not his best stuff, compared with what he has shown before in these forums. And I truly believe he would be a good fit for any of these publishers I mentioned. From my perspective, the only thing this guy need is to have the proper contacts.
Maybe you would like to address him to the attention of your artistic agent?
That could be a nice thing to do. Don't you think?
Hi Scribbly, thanks for believing in my work. i appreciate you trying to help me out with getting contacts. i already worked with BOOM studios a month ago, the series (Nightbreed) has just finished. i haven't gotten around to work with Dynamite because of schedule differences... i got C.B.'s email a few years back when he visited Manila, that's why everytime i get in between projects, i try to do some samples for Marvel, hoping for a tryout.. sometimes they reply, sometimes they don't .
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Old 05-18-2015, 01:27 AM   #19
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Quote:
Posted by MattTriano:
Now let's address your tone. You've commented here and elsewhere following my posts, always repeating questions I and other members of the board have sufficiently answered, adding backhanded quips disguised as honest queries or even compliments; you keep mentioning my agent here, for example, with a stinger attached. Each time you respond to me there's a caustic quality to your words. Air out the problem or don't, but please end this behavior for all our sakes. I come here to enjoy a community of people who want to make comics, who like to critique and be critiqued; there is an academic quality to it all that I miss from art school. That's why I'm here. I don't know why you are, Scribbly but if you don't like what I say or how I say it I'm open to addressing those things like real people. Tell me.
Well talking about tone. Maybe you should read what you just wrote.
Anytime I read something from you it sounds, harsh, mean, discouraging or caustic to everyone who dares to post something that is not totally well made to your standards, or have an opinion that you don't share as I may do sometimes. I respect and admire your artwork and I think you are very talented and that with your hard work you are making a good career in the field. But I don't like your extremism, if you ask me.
Sorry, I don't.
I believe everybody can improve at any level. Hundred and thousand of artists working at the big four are coming from places overseas and all around the world, since the inception of comics books.
Many comics artists as R. M. Guéra or Peter Snejbjerg had their breakout in American comics way past their forties.
Many artists can cost the travel to a comicon to show their samples, many are working through agents and agencies. I did that for many years. That is why I point it as possible option.
Many artists will never make it. Some guys think that working for the big 4 or some big publisher is the big thing ever that will assure their future, some don't mind a bit about it. There are thousand ways and options for producing comics outside the big4 as well.
Some people are luckier than others, that's all. The others, the less fortunate, they should keep trying no matter what. This count for any artistic endeavor.
My idea is to point on each colleague artist who is posting artwork or writing in these forums what they may need or what they can have improved on their artwork, suggesting ideas that intent to help them reach their goal, whichever it may be, not trashing everything just for the sake of it.
Sometimes, I will just praise what I feel is a pleasure to be seen or read.
I just enjoy comics and the people who continuously do workout on themselves to improve their artistic skills as I do. IMHO.

Going back to the initial subject, I guess Emmanuel should try some samples over "The Shadow". I think his style would make a good rendition of this character. Just a thought.
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Old 05-18-2015, 01:31 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by emmanuelxerxjavier View Post
Hi Scribbly, thanks for believing in my work. i appreciate you trying to help me out with getting contacts. i already worked with BOOM studios a month ago, the series (Nightbreed) has just finished. i haven't gotten around to work with Dynamite because of schedule differences... i got C.B.'s email a few years back when he visited Manila, that's why everytime i get in between projects, i try to do some samples for Marvel, hoping for a tryout.. sometimes they reply, sometimes they don't .
Well, glad to hear this buddy. Keep it up, you are cooking good stuff.
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Old 05-18-2015, 02:06 AM   #21
MattTriano
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Norton View Post
apologies for continuing the derail..

but I do want to address something to you Mr. Triano.

I to have noticed the back and forth between you and scribbly on occasion. I completely see your point on calling him out on his tone and attitude towards you. but if I may say, you sir have a serious tone and attitude yourself on more than one occasion.
let me explain.
it is certainly obvious that you know what you are doing. that's no question. I follow your art on Deviant art, and have looked you up after seeing you post here on DW. you know, to see who this opinionated guy is. And while your art isn't my favorite on a personal level, you clearly are very very good. an absolute pro.
But if im being honest, your replies sometimes carry the exact tone you are calling scribbly out on. in different ways. its 'caustic' in a way.
and sometimes its downright "douche" if you recall the time I called you that when your reply to another guy (cant remember who) was really egotistical and out of line. I seriously at that point had written you off, skills or not, as being a big ol dick and not worth interest.
BUT, to your credit, you acknowledged that you were out of lone, admitted it was due to other factors and not the fault of the original poster, and apologized.
I thought that was really upstanding. I thought "ok, Triano is just a guy, a human being like all of us. he can have his moments. I don't need to hold a grudge".
but you can see how that type of stuff shapes peoples opinions, right?

I cant deny that your opinions and crits of peoples works are probably correct 99% of the time. you know your stuff.
but your tone man... especially what you just said, about age... its really grinding on me man.
you are always asking peoples age, and I get where you are going with that. it IS a factor.
Heres what you just told me, by posting what you just did here. I am no good. I never will be, and I need to give up this dream of mine of drawing comics. because im to old.
thanks Matt. can I have my dream back when you are done wiping you ass with it.
I think its that kind of stuff that may rub people the wrong way.
look, im not stupid. I know its a LONG shot. probably never will happen. I know that. I am fully aware of the realities of this industry. im 38. im pissed cause I feel my youth slipping away and it makes me mad that I haven't had the opportunity I want yet. and I know with every passing year, im just getting older. and it may never happen.
but im gonna keep on trying. I don't exactly want to draw xmen or batman. I DO want to put together my own comic, submit it around, see if I can get it picked up...Image comics would be nice.
but that's like winning the comics lottery. 1 in a billion shot. I know that. but I think I may have something to offer. I think I have something to say that may be worthwhile.

and a guy like you, saying essentially, "give it up, its not gonna happen".

you really can crush a guys spirit sir.

how about, "keep trying man. you got some skills, but work on this or that or whatever.. keep going!!! comics are awesome and we all love the dream."?

I want to say again, I know you know what you are doing. what you are saying. its an experienced and educated point of view. but many of your responses (not all) are tinged with a "holier than tho" attitude. maybe you don't mean it that way. maybe you don't perceive it that way.
hell, maybe you DO know it, and don't care.(I doubt you are that heartless)

I just wanted to say these things to you..food for thought.

I have some sequentials I will be posting when I get the okay from the publisher... and I truly hope I get the straight forward "triano crit", cause I need to hear what I need to work on. (reference everything, work on my figures, work on backgrounds, work on storytelling, will all be things you will probably say to me.)
I look forward to it. I invite it and welcome it.

I don't need a pro telling me im to old and to give up this art I pursue cause its never gonna happen. that I don't need.

thanks for your time.

Rob

AGAIN, SORRY FOR ADDITONAL DERAIL
Thanks for saying something Rob, I don't mean to be a fuckhead. Most of my critiques are patterned after the way I was critiqued in school, usually via post-it notes on the backs of pages; sometimes I'm channelling Toth, who was notoriously caustic in critiques. I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings, but now that I know that I'm coming across harshly I'll keep that in mind.

I'm nobody special, just a guy. You're right about that. But I do take this very seriously, and sometimes I'm frustrated by my own limits as a writer to communicate intensely without being overbearing. Again I really am sorry. I'm no gatekeeper, I don't determine whether you or anyone else gets to follow their dreams; age really doesn't matter, it's not something you should be worried about (and I've amended my post to reflect it, the original draft got away from me).

Age. Location. Language. All mitigating factors. But ultimately in my experience, you just need to be good. And lucky.

I wish you luck with your project, let me know if I can help in any way.

Comics are awesome. We all love them, we all have dreams of making them. Keep going.

Best,
M
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Old 05-18-2015, 02:58 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scribbly View Post
Well talking about tone. Maybe you should read what you just wrote.
Anytime I read something from you it sounds, harsh, mean, discouraging or caustic to everyone who dares to post something that is not totally well made to your standards, or have an opinion that you don't share as I may do sometimes. I respect and admire your artwork and I think you are very talented and that with your hard work you are making a good career in the field. But I don't like your extremism, if you ask me.
Sorry, I don't.
I believe everybody can improve at any level. Hundred and thousand of artists working at the big four are coming from places overseas and all around the world, since the inception of comics books.
Many comics artists as R. M. Guéra or Peter Snejbjerg had their breakout in American comics way past their forties.
Many artists can cost the travel to a comicon to show their samples, many are working through agents and agencies. I did that for many years. That is why I point it as possible option.
Many artists will never make it. Some guys think that working for the big 4 or some big publisher is the big thing ever that will assure their future, some don't mind a bit about it. There are thousand ways and options for producing comics outside the big4 as well.
Some people are luckier than others, that's all. The others, the less fortunate, they should keep trying no matter what. This count for any artistic endeavor.
My idea is to point on each colleague artist who is posting artwork or writing in these forums what they may need or what they can have improved on their artwork, suggesting ideas that intent to help them reach their goal, whichever it may be, not trashing everything just for the sake of it.
Sometimes, I will just praise what I feel is a pleasure to be seen or read.
I just enjoy comics and the people who continuously do workout on themselves to improve their artistic skills as I do. IMHO.

Going back to the initial subject, I guess Emmanuel should try some samples over "The Shadow". I think his style would make a good rendition of this character. Just a thought.
I'm sorry to come across harshly, that is something I'll work on. I critique each page as if all the marks have been made intentionally, as if it were a portfolio review for artists who want to be professionals. That said my opinion is subjective and I respect the people who post here tremendously; it takes real guts to put yourself out there. I take exception to the charge that I am 'trashing' people's work; never my intent. My aim is to be thorough, and honest.

I enjoy comics and the people who make them too. We're all on the same team.

Keep going.

Best,
M
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Old 05-18-2015, 02:59 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by emmanuelxerxjavier View Post
Hi Scribbly, thanks for believing in my work. i appreciate you trying to help me out with getting contacts. i already worked with BOOM studios a month ago, the series (Nightbreed) has just finished. i haven't gotten around to work with Dynamite because of schedule differences... i got C.B.'s email a few years back when he visited Manila, that's why everytime i get in between projects, i try to do some samples for Marvel, hoping for a tryout.. sometimes they reply, sometimes they don't .
Fantastic! Has your work in Nightbreed come out yet?
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Old 05-18-2015, 03:32 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MattTriano View Post
Fantastic! Has your work in Nightbreed come out yet?
Hi Matt, yes, thanks for asking. Nightbreed series came out since October 2014(i think this was the month i joined in as a fill in) up to April 2015.
so i worked on 7pages, then 8pages then 11pages then 17pages then finally 22 pages on the last issue
http://bloody-disgusting.com/news/33...nightbreed-12/

i'm attaching some pages here, i hope it's alright.


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Old 05-18-2015, 04:02 AM   #25
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Nice work dude.
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Old 05-21-2015, 11:49 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MattTriano View Post
Thanks for saying something Rob, I don't mean to be a fuckhead. Most of my critiques are patterned after the way I was critiqued in school, usually via post-it notes on the backs of pages; sometimes I'm channelling Toth, who was notoriously caustic in critiques. I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings, but now that I know that I'm coming across harshly I'll keep that in mind.

I'm nobody special, just a guy. You're right about that. But I do take this very seriously, and sometimes I'm frustrated by my own limits as a writer to communicate intensely without being overbearing. Again I really am sorry. I'm no gatekeeper, I don't determine whether you or anyone else gets to follow their dreams; age really doesn't matter, it's not something you should be worried about (and I've amended my post to reflect it, the original draft got away from me).

Age. Location. Language. All mitigating factors. But ultimately in my experience, you just need to be good. And lucky.

I wish you luck with your project, let me know if I can help in any way.

Comics are awesome. We all love them, we all have dreams of making them. Keep going.

Best,
M
i appreciate that Matt. thanks for listening and the conversation.

rob
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